To the handful of posters on here...

who, simply because they have a different opinion to me and so accused me of being a 'little Englander', 'racist', 'xenophobic', 'odious' etc. ad nauseum without having even met me simply because I voted to Leave the EU, below is the prime reason I voted 'against' remain rather than 'for' leaving.........

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/16/euro-house-of-cards-to-collapse-warns-ecb-prophet/

This is a non- biased, expert view from one of the original architects of the Euro (although I am sure some of the Remain people on here will find some argument to dispel it - good luck with that!) as to where the Euro and EU is heading. It expresses, far better than I ever could, my own personal views on the reasons, in spite the continuous negative BBC reporting, whywe should be out of the EU (not to be confused with Europe) in spite of the 'pain' we are currently feeling - particularly those of us who have seen our household 'income' drop by 22% in the last few months.

The latest 'hardline statements' from Tusk and Junckers is simply bravado by desperate men, as, whilst they may argue that they (the EU commission) can insist that the British Government must have a complete EU exit with absolutely no compromises, they will be under extreme (and probably irresistible) pressure from the major industrial Corporations like Siemens, VAG, BMW, Mercedes, Merck Group, Peugot, Beyer, Michelin, Exorand many others. Many pension funds will in turn put them under pressure as major shareholders to ensure that their UK markets are kept open. Most of the anti UK rhetoric is from the politicians desperate to shore up the collapsing EU project.

 

Whilst I voted remain

I respect your right to a different opinion and have certainly never accused you of being any of the things you have listed.

I would agree that closer union as pursued by many in the EU is a bad thing, however, I still contend that the Uk being in Europe had a better chance of influencing that than it will from outside.

 

Didn't realise we had the Euro

 

Re: Whilst I voted remain

I did say a 'handful'. Actually the UK Govt nor any other EU Govt will have any control over the collapser of the Euro and subsequent collapse of the current EU. It is already on the road to self destruction for the reasons outlined in the article.

 

Nice try! However, there is no way that the EU will survive in its current state when the Eurozone implodes. Did you bother to actually READ the article?

 

Yeah. Its about his view on the Euro and ECB. Particularly noted this line: "Prof Issing is...open to the idea of a genuine United States of Europe built on proper foundations, but has warned repeatedly against trying to force the pace of integration, or to achieve federalism "by the back door"."

So he supports a reformed EU then.

 

I got that but it won't happen as the politicians in each of the countries would never be able to agree on the structure mainly because the overwhelming population of Europe (never mind the UK) would never accept it. Besides, a one size fits all -as demonstrated by the failing Euro - in a group of countries with such widely differing economies cannot and will not work.

 

Throughout history, mankind has waged war based on various spurious tribal determinations. Whether this is one village against the next (or tribes or islands/valleys, etc), right up to country vs country. Usually based on nothing more than accident of birth to what side you would fall on. If we continue with the small countries based on random historic divisions or geographical quirks then sooner or later we will destroy ourselves as a species and probably take out most of the rest of this planet.

Forcing everyone into a Federal Europe might be unpopular with this generation, but it would be less unpopular with our children, and their children until it was completely accepted. Remember its less than 200 years since the USA was in the middle of a civil war and while there are massive differences between the states, in general they work together.

Better still would be one nation state occupying the entire globe, where we can put aside our differences and work together to improve life for everyone.

 

Cant comment on that...but I will say you're a boring tw&t. Give it a feckin rest, this is football forum.

 

I've said on here before that if I gave a 'I had a dream' speech it would be that. I know people will give me a million reasons why they think it can't work but everyone is allowed to dream and I can die one day hoping/believing (?) that it will come true whether I'm alive to see it or not.

 

Wasn't the modern Italy a relatively modern creation existing as separate states but now despite the north/ south divide it is one country. Things change. Change is it always for the worse or so some people would have you believe.

Chap puts forward a reasoned argument about the Euro. He also stated that he is a firm believer in closer integration if done correctly so not sure how that would give you a footing to make any devising on.

Like others by and large I prefer the political philosophy of Bobby Collins or the initimate revelations of Bobby Horn to the ramblings of some bloke on about the Euro. The refendum was close but clear we should leave the EU. What is also clear is that the people who voted to leave primarily social classes CDE are the ones who will suffer most from rising food prices and a falling pound so you get what you deserve in life.

 

Agree that it would be wonderful. Except as a species we are competitive, and nature has dictated that survival of the fittest is the way species, on this planet at least, evolve. We need to deal with things as they really are and not how we would like them to be. Even acknowledging the dangers arising from different cultural and ideological differences gives rise to accusations of racism and intolerance.
That said there is nothing wrong in trying, where possible to change things for the better but some policies of the Marxist left are just Pie in the Sky. Most, people (sadly not all) do not seek to dominate others, choosing instead to try and live out their lives in peace, bring up a family people and if there is anything left over, help others where they can. Changing the world order is not and is unlikely to ever be achievable.

 

The problems he is talking about seem to be primarily concerned with the Euro and the imbalance of the economies which use it. “Realistically, it will be a case of muddling through, struggling from one crisis to the next. It is difficult to forecast how long this will continue for, but it cannot go on endlessly," = capitalism. These are problems inherent with the system of capitalism which depends on an impossibly ever-increasing demand in order to expand.Being outside of the EU will make no difference to these crises, except I think pejoratively as we'll be more isolated. He mentions the increased level of debt since the last crisis, for instance, which applies here just the same as the Tory austerity was supposed to eradicate it and completely failed to, on an individual and national level.

One person I'm sure you'll love as a Telegraph reader is David Harvey who is brilliant on this. Here is a very simplified but very watchable introduction to his ideas:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOP2V_np2c0

 

It is the attitude of a small few on here that have completely turned me off contributing to the frequent political posts that appear.

 

The internal contradictions of capital accumulation

 

There's no argument here. The UK does not participate in the the single currency mechanism. If anything, the failings outlined are echoed in the 5 tests of UK participation considered in the early-mid 90s, of which 4 failed and any chance of adopting the Euro indefinitely shelved.

Are you trying to say 'I told you so' on the back of that? It just doesn't make sense.

 

I know. Bolshy basturds, thinking for themselves. Is this what democracy has come to?

 

Its a football forum. There are plenty of polical forums out there imho.

 

It's a political thread inside a forum , anyone can ignore it and not read/reply.